>> ERIC: IT'S BEEN MORE THAN SIX WEEKS SINCE THE END OF OPERATION METRO SURGE WAS ANNOUNCED.

THE NUMBER OF FEDERAL AGENTS IN MINNESOTA HAS DECREASED SIGNIFICANTLY.

BUT LEGAL ACTION AGAINST IMMIGRANTS HAS INCREASED AT A PACE SOME SAY IS NEARLY UNSUSTAINABLE FOR DEFENDANTS AND THEIR ATTORNEYS.

JULIA DECKER IS AN IMMIGRATION ATTORNEY AND POLICY DIRECTOR FROM THE IMMIGRANT LAW CENTER OF MINNESOTA.

WELCOME BACK.

GIVE US A LITTLE CONTEXT OF HOW BUSY IT'S BEEN FOR LAWYERS.

>> YEAH, SO AS YOU MENTIONED, EVEN THOUGH THE AGENTS SORT OF NUMERICALLY SEEM TO HAVE WITHDRAWN, THE IMPACT FOR THE PEOPLE WHO WERE SWEPT UP IN THE SURGE CONTINUE TO BE FELT BY THOSE IMPACTED.

SO ALL OF THOSE PEOPLE THAT WERE SWEPT UP, THAT WERE ARRESTED, DETAINED, EVEN IF THEY HAVE BEEN RELEASED, ARE STILL IN THE SYSTEM.

SO THEY MAY BE FACING IMMIGRATION PROCEEDINGS, FEDERAL COURT PROCEEDINGS.

>> Eric: IS DUE PROCESS BEING FOLLOWED?

>> THAT'S A -- YOU'RE GOING TO GET A LAWYER'S ANSWER ON THAT.

IT DEPENDS.

THERE ARE -- BECAUSE THERE ARE OFTEN MULTIPLE PROCEEDINGS THAT PEOPLE ARE FACING, THE SORT OF TYPE OF PROCESS THAT THEY ARE GOING TO GET, OFTEN DEPENDS.

>> Cathy: WHAT -- CAN YOU EXPLAIN FOR FOLKS ABOUT THE SO-CALLED -- SOME FOLKS ARE FAST TRACKED, SO-CALLED SO SOMAI DOCKET?

>> A NEW DOCKET WAS CREATED WITHIN THE IMMIGRATION COURT HERE IN MINNESOTA, SPECIFICALLY FOR THIS POPULATION OF PEOPLE WITHIN THE IMMIGRATION COURT.

THIS HAPPENED PREVIOUSLY UNDER THE PREVIOUS TRUMP ADMINISTRATION FOR UNACCOMPANIED MINORS.

A DOCKET SIMILARLY WAS CREATED SPECIFICALLY FOR THAT POPULATION.

THIS IS SIGNIFICANT IN THE SENSE THAT HAS CREATED NOW FOR A SPECIFIC NATIONALITY.

THAT'S NOTABLE.

BUT, YES, THAT IS -- THIS IS ANOTHER SORT OF -- I WOULD SAY, TARGETS ATTEMPT BY THE ADMINISTRATION.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS CONCERNING.

FOR MULTIPLE REASONS.

>> Cathy: IS IT LEGAL?

MANY PEOPLE WOULD PROBABLY ASK THAT QUESTION?

>> SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE'S LIKELY TO POTENTIALLY BE SOME CHALLENGES IN FEDERAL COURT AS THERE HAVE BEEN ACROSS, YOU KNOW, TOO MANY OF THE ADMINISTRATION'S ACTIONS.

ONE OF THE DIFFICULTIES WITH CHALLENGING THINGS IN FEDERAL COURT, THOUGH, IS THAT THOSE WHEELS TURN ERY SLOWLY, AS WE'RE SEEING LITIGATION AGAINST MANY OF THE ACTIONS THAT OCCURRED DURING THE SURGE IS STILL ONGOING RIGHT NOW EVEN THOUGH, YOU KNOW, IT'S WEEKS AFTER THE SURGE.

>> Eric: I'M GUESSING IT'S HARD TO COME UP WITH PRECISE NUMBERS, BUT I THINK, LIKE, 3700 ARRESTS WERE MADE DURING THE SURGE.

AND IT WAS ADVERTISED, THAT THIS IS THE WORST OF THE WORST.

WAS IT LIMITED TO THAT?

>> SO A COUPLE POINTS.

I WOULD NOTE FIRST THAT THAT'S SORT OF THE NUMBER THAT WE'RE TOLD.

SO -- AND IT CAN BE DIFFICULT TO OFTEN SORT OF CONFIRM THOSE NUMBERS INDEPENDENTLY.

SO WE ARE SOMETIMES DEALING -- HAVING TO SORT OF GO OFF OF NUMBERS THAT WE'RE BEING OLD BY THE ADMINISTRATION THAT IS THEMSELVES CARRYING THESE OPERATIONS OUT AND TRANSPARENCY HAS BEEN DIFFICULT TO COME BY.

WE DO KNOW FROM, YOU KNOW, NUMBERS THAT WE ARE BEING ABLE TO GET THAT IT APPEARS THAT MANY OF THE PEOPLE BEING ARRESTED AND DETAINED NATIONWIDE OFTEN DO NOT HAVE CRIMINAL RECORDS -- >> Eric: THEY'RE N A CIVIL PROCEEDING IMMIGRATION-WISE?

RIGHT?

>> CORRECT, IMMIGRATION PROCEEDINGS ARE CIVIL PROCEEDINGS.

NOW, IT IS POSSIBLE THAT PEOPLE MAY HAVE A CRIMINAL VIOLATION ON THEIR RECORD BUT IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT IT COULD BE A MISDEMEANOR VIOLATION LIKE A SPEEDING TICKET OR A RELATIVELY LOW LEVEL VIOLATION THAT COULD ALSO BE CONSIDERED A CRIMINAL RECORD.

IT COULD LSO BE THAT SOMEBODY HAD BEEN CHARGED BUT NOT ET CONVICTED.

THIS VERY BROAD CATEGORY OF CRIMINAL, THERE'S A LOT OF NUANCE IN THAT DISCUSSION.

>> Cathy: I CAN'T -- GIVEN THE NUMBERS WE'VE SEEN IN TERMS OF CASE LOAD, DO YOU HAVE ANY DEA HOW LONG THESE CASES MIGHT PLAY OUT IN COURT.

IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD TAKE A LONG TIME?

>> THESE CASES CAN TAKE A VERY, VERY LONG TIME AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT -- I WAS ACTUALLY JUST LOOKING AT SOME OF THE INFORMATION THAT WAS VERY RECENTLY BEING PULLED, RELEASED VIA SOME OF THE FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT THAT WERE NOT ABLE TO BE GOTTEN UNTIL RECENTLY THROUGH LITIGATION BY SOME NATIONAL ORGANIZATIONS, THE SORT OF ARTICLING WAITING -- AVERAGE WAITING TIMES FOR CASES IN MINNESOTA IS SOMETHING LIKE 7 700 DAYS FROM THE ISSUANCE OF THE CHARGING DOCUMENT FOR PEOPLE.

AND THAT, TO BE CLEAR, CROSS BOTH DETAINED AND NON-DETAINED CASES.

DETAINED CASES ARE MOVING FASTER.

BUT THOSE ARE ALSO CASES WHERE IF, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE WANT TO CONTINUE TO FIGHT THEIR CASE AND THEY ARE SITTING IN DETENTION FOR A LONG TIME, WE HAVE SEEN CASES, FOR INSTANCE, LAST MONTHS OR EVEN YEARS AND PEOPLE RE SITTING IN DETENTION THE ENTIRE TIME THAT THEY ARE FIGHTING FOR THEIR LIVES, ESSENTIALLY, WHILE THEY ARE SITTING IN THAT DETENTION CENTER.

>> Eric: WELL, THANKS FOR COMING OVER AND SHARING.

WE KNOW YOU'VE BEEN BUSY.